Male abortions

MMMMMMM interesting concept, never heard of it before, very good point

Too many times I've known men that out of the blue get nailed and their lives destroyed due to a "fling" from years ago and all of a sudden they are racked with a huge debt. Now I'm not trying to push for men getting off scot free, but seriously. There should be a reasonable amount of logic applied. Responsibility should be on the woman to inform the man when she is pregnant and not coming after him 10 years later. There also needs to be a voice of the father in the decision to keep it or abort it since he's going to be held responsible financially. There's a lot of them out there but as it is today the father is nothing more than a paycheck.

no one can relinquish rights until the child is born. and no, I don't think men should be allowed to do it until after that point.

I should have added that minds get changed and the only reasonable time for a relinquishment to happen is after the child is born.

I wonder about those like octomom who go for the massive invetro. You know she is going to be going on the public dime (unless her reality series takes off). Perhaps the doctor in that case should be held financially responsible.

I am going back 9+ years, but in Texas there has to be notification on the part of a parental registry published (newspaper). That way if there is no response after 40 days, then the man cannot come back to reclaim parentage. This was put in part for adoptions that ended up disrupted because of that very reason.

Instead of free viagra, I believe in free contraception. If you don't use it, face the consequences. But that's just my opinion

Many women (not all) do exploit their situation for money as there is are systems in place to support mothers, not fathers, in our society. This topic carries much further than just for abortions in my opinion. Both genders should be equally responsible, and programs designed for children SHOULD help the children and not punish them and treat them as pawns as today's gender-biased family law dictates.

It takes two.....

We muchly try to avoid consequences, don't we? I have done it, I bet you have, too. I am currently fighting for the right to see my daughter regularly - it's interesting how there are many sides to this issue.

We all have. Let the first one who hasn't throw that stone. But, we can also point to instances, laws, policies, and other outside phenomena that contribute to that behavior. When we stop making this a game and treat it as real life, good things will happen. Not the best, mind you, but I firmly believe there are better solutions than the current stone throwing that we witness in today's "courts".

Keep fighting for it. I told MF this earlier, but my brother just went through a very long and contentious divorce (they have a 13yo daughter from the marriage as well), it took a little over two years. Not only did the ex-wife lose much of what she wanted, but she also lost custody of their daughter. Make sure you document everything.

And yup, family issues are never truly cut and dry.

The specific law I'm talking about that was proposed specifically allows for men to relinquish their rights early into the pregnancy.

That is where I ultimately get hung up when I have this debate in my head. Ultimately it is a child's life at stake, but if such a policy resulted in less unwanted children, then isn't that a victory for the well being of children?

Thinking about it, I'm actually against any gender biased law, unless women can also relinquish their rights in this situation as well to a willing father. Is that part of the deal?

At that point, the "fetus" would have to be recognized as a viable baby and then you are going into abortion rulings--possibly changing that structure. You can't legislate the ability of signing relinquishment to something that supposedly wouldn't need to exist. It can only happen when there is a physical, living child. Men can seek an attorney at any time to look into relinquishment following birth. If the woman is on the public dole, it may not be very easy to do however.

The circumstances are therefore fluid and subject to interpretation, which to me sounds a little sketchy when dealing with the life of a human - but there are no guarantees are there?

That's what family law has been telling us for decades now, and look at the mess it has become. If we had no laws regarding this the kids would still be better off IMO. "For the Kids" has become that be-all-catch phrase that is meaningless to me as they continue to be played as pawns by warring parents who can't get over themselves. Divide it (time with kid) 50/50 regardless of finances and/or any other outside phenomena, unless one is a true abuser. Allegations must be proven and not just slung around like candy at the dentist. Perjury should be the result of anyone making false and untrue allegations and that should settle that.

That is far from what happens today.

In my opinion yes, men should be allowed to have male abortion. Its not like each and every men wants their own baby right? I mean it all depends on the situation and each and everyones circumstances. Bottomline is every couples situation would not b exactly the same so if ever there's a strong need, men should be allowed to just in case.

Another issue that will not be resolved fairly if left to the court system. Personal responsibility like morality is tough to legislate.
Equality is a concept that exists in utopia only - try and find a ticket or directions there!

Chatting with girlfriends this weekend, I heard about a court case involving a pharmacist filling a prescription wrong.  Instead of birth control pills, the woman received something else.  She became pregnant.  She successfully sued said pharmacist for child support.  He is now counter-suing for visitation.  True case.

Males cannot get an "abortion".  Sorry, but the life is still alive if the woman doesn't abort/miscarry.  Parentage has to be terminated after the birth occurs.  Too many legal issues pre-birth.

It's a simple formula really. If the man doesn't want a child, keep his dick in his pants.

If he makes a child he should be responsible for it. That being said, I agree with Pagan that hitting a man up after 10 years or whatever for child support when he didn't know the child existed is bullshit.

Let us not forget also the responsibility of the mother to allow the Father to be a part of the Childs life.  Overwhelming majority of these cases all the Father is is a pay check and the Mother even defies court orders for visitation with no consequences what so ever.  The Judicial System says "So What" and tells the Father to Fuck Off.  I have seen this far to often, I myself am a product of a mother who refused my Father any contact with me growing up.

It takes two. Both should be EQUALLY as responsible, no matter what.

Statistics have shown that single mother families have more trouble with kids thatn the other way around.

Agreed!

I must also say I have known only a few Women who have not only allowed visitation but actively encouraged the kids have a relationship with their fathers.

Using kids as a weapon against the Father is so screwed up, it messes the kids up and in the end most come around and discover the truth that ends up with them causing huge resentment towards the mother. 

Funny thing about the truth, it always comes out eventually 

Okay the system sucks and it really sucks if you are a male, white and not fucking stupid! Don't even get me going on this issue.
I was victimized by this Family court bullshit, but you know after so many years you are finally free of it. I pity those who still have to deal with the zealots and feminists that control that whole bullshit system. See them all in hell hopefully!
Keep in mind guys that smile on your face may be just the initial symtom of the most expensive piece of ass you have ever had!

Think of how much in child support Jon Gosslin will be paying :-)  He really ought to suck it up and consider counseling instead!  It'd be cheaper

Gosselin quit his job to take care of the kids. You cannot support counseling in lieu of child support. The one who will have to "suck it up" here, iks both, as the TV monies they have made is their primary source of income.

Women now need to learn how to "suck it up" as well when they are at fault. Currently, they can play the victim card in many ways shapes and forms, which is why I advise all who are truly being abused to get cameras. That is what saved John Gosselin here.

I agree with getting off the camera, but puhleeeeze.... he was caught red handed--or caught with his hand in the cookie jar, so to speak.  He is very passive agressive and plays his own "victim" role.  He had as much opportunity to speak out against a show and keep his IT job, instead, he quits it to work on the reality show.  He knew how she was when they married, just as she knew how he was pre-marriage.  With that many kids, they should try to work things out.  But hey, we live in the day of divorce.  They both remind me of my sister and her ex. 

I should have added that he is now choosing to move to a NY apartment (in Trump tower?), so I guess he is choosing to give up being a close-in-proximity parent.  With that many kids, so young, I don't get that.  IMO he is pissed about his wife's book deals after quitting his own job.

While I agree with your sentiment, I disagree with your grasp on reality here, Solje. MANY men are emasculated by their partners, and the system, both legally and otherwise. These days, the courts award the children to mothers over 85% of the time, often behind a veil of secrecy, which should be unfair in any situation.

That said, the mother was also caught red handed, in both affairs, the beating of her own kids and her emasculation of her man. And what is wrong with him holding down the fort? Do you say women quit their jobs as a choice as well? I'll go to bat for this guy as I know her next step will be the use of parental alienation, whether he wants it or not. She'll badmouth the hell out of him in front of her own children while stating otherwise. He won't. We've seen him do that many times as well. Which one is better?

We've seen her do it in public along with yanking her children around like puppet dolls. Yet, a man doing those same things would be iinstantly vilified. That fact that there is sympathy for him speaks volumes against the standards mores that exist out there.

It takes two. And he's been there for these children much more than the mother has here. DAILY.

Please give that reality show trash their own thread!

Men and good fathers out there don't get the respect they deserve. This man was a good father.

In fact, I'll state he was a better father to his kids than she was as a mother to hers.

Me, too.

would there be a term unwanted? responsible decisions are sometimes left out when your in a situiation when all you think first is the pleasure. Will contraception are always there to be used. If you don't want responsibilties, better yet prevent it. Who gets affected is the child.

The problem is much deeper than that, when the Father is treated only as a Sperm Donar and Paycheck the ones that suffers is the Father AND the Child.

So i hear you that we should pitty Men for they are being treated like this? They are the victims you say?

Not asking for pity other than pity for the children, for they are the ones who suffer without having a father.  Sit in a U.S. Family Court sometime and you'll see the machine at work.  Like I said, I myself am a product of a Mother who refused my father any contact with me growing up.

Okay i understand that, but guess its better not to generalize things because there are also left out children because of irresponsible father. Though i really admit a feeling of not having a father growing up makes you feel not complete. Looking for a father figure and a fact that affects ones behaviour or some psychological thing in us.

I did have a father figure, the one my mother had an affair with and divorce my father then married him.  My Step Father was central, but that's a whole other story in itself.  I never had a relationship with my real father until my teens.

Bottom line is I'm not the "out of ordinary", I'm the norm here in the U.S.  Like I said before you start repeating the "generalization" one needs to actually look at the dirty facts.

Okay
i understand that, but guess its better not to generalize things
because there are also left out children because of irresponsible
father. Though i really admit a feeling of not having a father growing
up makes you feel not complete. Looking for a father figure and a fact
that affects ones behaviour or some psychological thing in us.

Both parents are needed in successful upbringings. That much CLINICAL research has shown. Statistics also point to more problems with fatherless homes than motherless homes. Normally, FATHERS are singled out by angry women, NOW, and other extremist organizations whose work has nothing to do with a child's interest, but more to do with politics and power. Their research and statistics are bogus, and their research lacks basis. Here is a link for you on many of the dirty tricks that are both subversive and nasty in nature. - http://wadvpress.org/?p=250 .

Read my website and tell me what you may disagree with. But, I do ask you to bring well thought out material as I have done much research along these lines and I'm gearing up to call this folly unconstitutional, which is EXACTLY what it is. Leave emotions out of it and bring your "facts". I will show you where they are wrong and why.

WADVPress

http://wadvpress.org

It all depends on situations. But male should not be dominated in this issue. Both consent may be they can.

Sorry, but if you do not want to be treaten as a Sperm Donar and Paycheck you maybe have to think it over in another way.

Even if you are in a marriage and have children the whole thing can end up in an divorce and you could be the one paying for it.

So if you do not want to be the Sperm Donar or the Paycheck for children, get yourself a sterilization and off you are.

Nobody has to have children even if he loses his mind while being out of pants.

Please think it over.

You do not want to have children- you want your sexual fun - well, why not a sterilization and you never will be blamed for children.

I think taking care after all has happened is a worst case scenario. Thinking must come before the pregnancy.

It's true that men get shafted by the system. What that needs, is a complete flip of the system, and a flip-off to the women that defy court orders. A man should be able to take the case to court, with -no- jury, and prove to the Judge that the mother is not allowing him the right to see his children.

Judge bangs his gavel, and the woman loses her entitlement to child support as punishment for violating the fathers rights.

Makes common sense but it won't happen.  Too many big powerful radical man hating womans groups out there with well paid Lobbyists pulling the strings. 

Bull.

Men are beginning to get lobbyists of their own.

Are you serious? you have a chance at a male abortion minute one...go it alone. Maybe people take sex to lightly and the people your involved with. Everytime you engage you roll the dice... Every person you sleep with is a potential parent of your child. To ask a person to damage their body after the fact or values is sad and pathetic. I beleive the only reason society thinks like this is the old mighty dollar. If people protected there legacy of children (semen and eggs) the way they did their wallets there would be fewer issues pertianing to bickering and finger pointing after the fact. And I am not sure where you folks live that say men are the only ones held liable but in my state its the missing parent, most women I know maybe collect 200-300 a month, no profit, for three kids born during wedlock. Do the math...300/3 is 100 buxs a kid...hmm man where is the pink caddie. There a few luckier women or men, where the absent parent steps up, knowing the true cost of raising kids. For an extra room its 200 per month, shoes and clothes second hand 50-60 per child, food 150 per kid (hotdogs), entertainment...go play in the empty field little stick ball...sorry no tennis for you.

So if you want a choice think with your other head...and think man I really want this 15 minutes of fun in the sun but is this the kind of person I want to have any control over my future? Don't blame someone else for your poor judgement and cry after the fact.

Think of all the women who have a child with a supposed willing partner who walks out when she gains weight for a slimmer funnier person...can she put back the kid or force him who helped her decide to raise it or take it so she can go play..think not. But again she/he both need to think long and hard before throwing caution to the wind over one night stands, fast/short relationships, or because it WAS fun.

PS I would love for someone to pick my kids up every weekend or 50% of the time but all the men I know only seem to make it when its convient...kids aren'

t convient their are people with lives as well. I know of about 20 women left by husbands and exboyfriends that only wanted a defined visitation for lowering childsupport payments then never show up..week after week but the sure have the extra cash to take thier new fling out to dinner, disneyland, or vegas for the weekend... while the kids wait by the phone. I can say I know alot of men and no one really wants to deal with the kids on a 24/7 over all. I will not generalize though because I knew a few stay at home fathers, and when and if they seperate, i hope that the primary care taker remains in care for the kids sakes. So as i said in the last post do your male abortion proactively..."take matters into your own HAND", don't be a victim.

"

It's a simple formula really. If the man doesn't want a child, keep his dick in his pants.

If he makes a child he should be responsible for it. That being said, I agree with Pagan that hitting a man up after 10 years or whatever for child support when he didn't know the child existed is bullshit. "

hmm maybe he should be happy not to have worried about it for 10 years or maybe he promised for ever to pay, maybe it took 10 years to track him down you cant' just dump semen across america or the world and expect to wonder off into the sun set (act like each semen is $185k, which is a low low end of cost of raising a kid, no braces, no college)...and why should he be hit up? Shouldnt he know the relation enough to know she was pregnant and made sure to fulfill all obligations without society having to foot his 1/2 of the bill or track him down like an animal? People complain but are the people willing to pay for this man and womans reckless actions? should the child? You know people need to grow up. Kids are the product and the only victims. We as a society sadly are forced to lead both men and women to clinics for contraception and courts to make sure the children gets what they need. I hold everyone who takes sex so lightly responsible...with sex comes choices and responsibilitys, its not just a toy.

The woman was a complete flake, she dated him for about 6 months then disappeared only to reappear in the form of a letter demanding years of back Child support and welfare plus interenst on all.  Clyde was wiped out, had to sell everything, move into his parents, turn over his pay checks for the next up-teenth years.

This may be radical, but I propose chastity belts until the person is in a committed relationship, or gay.  If that person decides to take it off, then they have to sign a contract stating that if personal birth control is not used, that they could be responsible for 20 years for resulting offspring.  Once our guv sets up a DNA database, as soon as the child is born, authorities will know who to target immediately.  The only way out?  If relinquishment of rights is chosen, then snip-snip or else another chastity belt will be installed until it is proven you can be trusted with birth control measures again.

Sound ok with everyone?  I'm sure the Science Czar would be even more proactive in his approach to undesireds, like birth control in drinking water for example.